|
Post by davemurphy on Jun 23, 2012 10:10:29 GMT -5
In the following edition of his Fight Game show, beginning at the 13:20 mark, Jim Lampley gives us a replay of Round 7 without any commentary in an effort to show a disparity between the Judges and Compubox, but unintentionally he provided us with visual proof how braindead the Compubox employee assigned to Tim Bradley was that night. The final tally was 27-11 in favor of Pacquiao, but total up the number of blows YOU think Tim Bradley landed and tell me if THAT isn't the "smoking gun" that Lampley DIDN'T intend for you to be seeing. I'd be VERY surprised if you only came up with 11 landed blows for Desert Storm.......I counted at least that many to the body alone. sosoboxing.com/boxing-video-watch-online/fight-game-with-jim-lampley-episode-2/
|
|
|
Post by billyc on Jun 25, 2012 3:14:07 GMT -5
How many times have I said that CB is BS murph? It goes to show you that until the human element is removed...we can't even talk about CB until AFTER the fight and as a conversation pc only.
|
|
|
Post by davemurphy on Jun 25, 2012 16:06:51 GMT -5
How many times have I said that CB is BS murph? It goes to show you that until the human element is removed...we can't even talk about CB until AFTER the fight and as a conversation pc only. My problem with CB has usually been that Lampley doesn't know how to properly evaluate the numbers, not the process itself. He can't seem to talk about anything else, he's got CB on the Brain. This was the first fight in a long while where I believe missed blows were scored as connects. Here's a much better video showing examples (and HBO reactions to non-connects):
|
|
|
Post by billyc on Jul 2, 2012 7:03:34 GMT -5
the bottom line is that CB is the SUBJECTIVE view of the person counting....and their view from where they are seated.
|
|
|
Post by davemurphy on Jul 2, 2012 18:55:58 GMT -5
the bottom line is that CB is the SUBJECTIVE view of the person counting....and their view from where they are seated. No question, and I thought Rd 7's replay on the Lampley show was a great example of that. I certainly didn't see a 27-11 round. What's absolutely hilarious is the WBC thinking that the way to improve Judging is to add extra buttons to the Compubox system, did you see Sulamien's suggestion, BC? www.thesweetscience.com/news/articles/14834-weigh-in-what-do-you-think-of-wbc-plan-to-fix-bad-judging
|
|
|
Post by billyc on Jul 3, 2012 4:06:18 GMT -5
I did...and I actually liked it! I didn't take it as they wanting to improve CB..more like change to a new system outside the 10-pt-must. Remember..they think they ARE boxing.
|
|
|
Post by davemurphy on Jul 5, 2012 9:17:13 GMT -5
I did...and I actually liked it! I didn't take it as they wanting to improve CB..more like change to a new system outside the 10-pt-must. Remember..they think they ARE boxing. I don't know, sounds to me like it's same concept, just different buttons..............in fact, with scoring not just what lands but whether it's a "glancing blow" or not, in many ways it might be even more difficult. I bet nobody EVER lands anything on Chavez Jr. that isn't a "glancing blow" Hey, no matter how you slice it, as long ANY SYSTEM involves hitting buttons instead of analyzing the fighters, then 15-year-old Gamers who've never watched a single professional boxing match are superior to 50-year old judges that have 20-years experience but never punched a button.
|
|
|
Post by billyc on Jul 6, 2012 12:56:18 GMT -5
Today I talked about it on the show and during the short Thumbs Up & Thumbs Down show... as long as a humman is tracking the stats...its not fact and will be subjective. Remove the human and then we will have true stats.
|
|
|
Post by davemurphy on Jul 8, 2012 15:13:45 GMT -5
Today I talked about it on the show and during the short Thumbs Up & Thumbs Down show... as long as a humman is tracking the stats...its not fact and will be subjective. Remove the human and then we will have true stats. Yeah, I heard that on the replay. I'm dreading when HBO unveils this new toy they have with the computer chip, because while it will measure force and speed, it doesn't tell us where the punch landed. That small omission makes it totally useless, just one more needless thing for Lampley to jabber about instead of calling the action taking place right in front of him. P.S. You wonder if it will evolve into Fighters wearing a vest that registers hits, like our troops do in simulated combat, or a touchpad like Olympic Fencers use. All this technology in an attempt to get what you call true stats in order to replace incompetent judges. It shouldn't be this difficult.
|
|
|
Post by billyc on Jul 9, 2012 13:06:56 GMT -5
All we really need is the gloves to have a transmitter built in, which can be the size of a pea and put tape on receiveers...sort of like those round band-aids on the fighter and its done! The technology is there....
|
|
|
Post by davemurphy on Jul 12, 2012 16:59:05 GMT -5
All we really need is the gloves to have a transmitter built in, which can be the size of a pea and put tape on receiveers...sort of like those round band-aids on the fighter and its done! The technology is there.... BC- Yeah, that's kind of what I was getting at when referencing the vests worn in simulated combat (I remember those being in the movie Heartbreak Ridge over 20 years ago, and I'm sure the technology has moved well beyond that). But we get back to the original question and that's if we really want to go to a straight numbers system in place of judges. IMO, even a totally EXACT system, one that's guaranteed to register actual speed,power,and accuracy................doesn't replace a trained judge with 20 years experience. I simply REFUSE to believe that the same method of training judges we've used for the last 100 years has suddenly become broken. While it's true that we had bad decisions in the past, we have outside factors that are producing them once a week (in less fights today than we had in the past, I might add) instead of once a month (if that). Scrap the Orgs being involved in the selection process, give me experienced and INDEPENDENT Judges, complete without repercussions if they vote the "wrong" way, toss in a pencil and pad of paper, and I'll take that over all the techno junk you can pile up.
|
|
|
Post by billyc on Jul 13, 2012 3:24:40 GMT -5
The World Is A Changing Murph! As a matter of fact...its changed in the last 10 yrs! The problem we have with the judges is the same problem we have with trainers...we are losing the good teachers. Its all part of the course and someday...the old guys will be talking about great fighters as being the FMJ and the PACs...they will have forgotten the real greats. Its too bad...but it is what it is.
|
|
|
Post by davemurphy on Jul 16, 2012 19:26:10 GMT -5
Agreed, BC. There's simply no instruction taking place, not just Trainer to Fighter or Judge Mentor to Judge Student, but in particular where it's the most evident (IMO) and that's from Oldtime Promoter to Johnny-come-lately, Mr. Willie Spendapenny who sends out mass e-mails in place of actual PR and puts their product on GFL for $10, thinking their going to get rich. Boxing is seemingly a weak chain where each succeeding link holds less and less. I wonder how much longer we can hold off womens softball in terms of remaining Americas 37th favorite sport
|
|
|
Post by billyc on Jul 17, 2012 3:15:49 GMT -5
mr. Willie Spendapenny...I LOVE IT!!!!! You hit the nail on the head right there Murph. They all DO think all you need to do is put it on FB...its a joke and sad....but so are all of the Wanna-be writers, radio, TV, etc, etc, etc....when added together.....we have boxing in 2012. Do you think it will survive? I think it will only because it has for so long.
|
|
|
Post by davemurphy on Jul 17, 2012 10:27:07 GMT -5
mr. Willie Spendapenny...I LOVE IT!!!!! You hit the nail on the head right there Murph. They all DO think all you need to do is put it on FB...its a joke and sad....but so are all of the Wanna-be writers, radio, TV, etc, etc, etc....when added together.....we have boxing in 2012. Do you think it will survive? I think it will only because it has for so long. Yeah, it'll survive but in a lesser form than before. Basically the sports been losing fans since the turn of the last century when it and horse racing were #1 and only baseball existed among today's major sports. Boxing will remain, but with increasingly less attractive cable vehicles as the shortsighted, narrow focus thinking that's killed us the last 15 years or so only becomes more pronounced. I was talking to our friend George, who's perfectly happy with fights on second tier cable outlets about the importance of actual network TV exposure and he just didn't seem to "get it" as far as viewership numbers and their importance. I pointed out that the average FNF is seen by roughly 650K viewers whereas the guys from Contender Season One on NBC were seen by over 8 Million, and that was a low rating for a summer replacement series. That exposure got Manfredo, Alfonso Gomez, etc. fights they didn't deserve for several years. He has a good point that Boxing is probably dead as far as the networks are concerned, we're like a dinosaur that had it's day and is extinct. HBO's overpaid these guys to the point where the Networks can't sell enough advertising to cover the purses. For example, the other night (from NSAC figures): Khan - $950,000 Garcia - $520,000 On CBS, NBC, or ABC, you simply can't make enough on 14 one-minute spots spread out over an hour in order to pay for that. In it's day, the advantage of boxing was that unlike sitcoms, you could get by with a commercial every three minutes, but in narrowing our viewership while at the same time raising the pay, we cut off our own necks and now it's too late to put the genie back in the bottle.
|
|