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Post by bourbonblues on Aug 30, 2010 13:21:44 GMT -5
Three points:
1) Judging MMA on James Toney vs. Randy Couture isn't wise. Couture is 47 and Toney is a first-timer. This isn't going to represent the sport.
2) MMA is more visually exciting to a new fight fan than boxing is. Once a fan has watched enough to grasp the essentials, both sports are fascinating and exciting, but the learning curve for boxing is steeper. A 14 year old watching a typical UFC show vs., say, a Super Six event, the teenager will likely enjoy the UFC more. This sucks, but it is the truth. It is something boxing promoters have to over-come by promoting far better than they do now. Boxing needs some exciting, charismatic, take-on-all-comers, baddest-man-on-the-planet-type guys, and fast.
3) Although the history of MMA only goes back to 1993, the sport already has its legends. Early fighters are revered.
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Post by billyc on Aug 30, 2010 14:39:10 GMT -5
I think you hit it on the head Burbon....Boxing needs to promote better! The REASON why the younger fans like MMA is because of just that. Face it....after two guys fall to the ground leg-locked....that is no way more exciting as say the Segura-Calderon fight. The thing is...they HEARD about the UFC fight and NOT the Segura fight!
Switch to scotch!
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Post by bourbonblues on Aug 30, 2010 16:04:33 GMT -5
Face it....after two guys fall to the ground leg-locked....that is no way more exciting as say the Segura-Calderon fight. It can be, once you know the different mounts, chokes and arm/leg locks, it becomes very exciting. Watch the crowd sometimes durning a high-end UFC grappling contest - they go crazy when someone comes close to a submission hold, gains position, counters or reverses something. And the learning curve to grasp this is only a show or two, so kids can get into it very easily. I'm not saying everyone will like it, or that I've seen anything this year as good as the Israel Vazquez vs. Rafael Marquez trilogy a kind gent sent me on DVR recently, but how often are we getting those kind of fights in front of a new audience? 'Cause from what I can tell, that's gotta be the goal - get the kids watching. One other thing about the MMA talk today - UFC's events outside of Vegas generally has crowds like this. The Vegas fans though tend to show up late - lots of empty seats until the main events. I dunno why that is. |
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Post by billyc on Aug 30, 2010 16:08:38 GMT -5
Because boxing goes with the casinos better than MMA. I read the stats on that. The boxing crowd stays and spends money at the casinos during fights. The MMA crowd drinks beer in the parking lot....goes in for the show....then leaves. They do not hang in the casinos, where as the boxing people do...gamble, spend money in the rest's, stores, etc.
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Post by mh2365 on Aug 30, 2010 16:45:43 GMT -5
It's Chess vs Checkers .... I love all the chest thumping MMA fans are doing knowing they don't have to worry about Dana White letting one of his guys in a boxing ring ... I give Dana credit he is a smart man and knows how to market ....
He knows if he let anyone of his guys in a boxing ring they would get KTFO inside of 3 rounds easily and look foolish doing it.
So Couture beat Toney at checkers when Toney spent his life playing chess big whoop ... pretty sure Rafa Nadal could whoop Tiger Woods at tennis too
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Post by davemurphy on Aug 31, 2010 6:48:02 GMT -5
Yeah, it's always been Apples and Oranges to me, I've never figured out just why anyone puts any importance into it. Yes, a Martial Arts expert will beat any professional Boxer by wrapping them up and not getting hit in the first few seconds. He's just taking advantage of some down and out Boxers need for money. Pitchers in the AA Minor Leagues were also able to throw Curvetballs by the Greatest Basketball Player of All Time. So what?
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Post by davemurphy on Aug 31, 2010 6:54:48 GMT -5
Because boxing goes with the casinos better than MMA. I read the stats on that. The boxing crowd stays and spends money at the casinos during fights. The MMA crowd drinks beer in the parking lot....goes in for the show....then leaves. They do not hang in the casinos, where as the boxing people do...gamble, spend money in the rest's, stores, etc. Yep,that's the one advantage Boxing still has, Billy C. The MMA crowd might buy a T-shirt at the Arena they sell out, but it doesn't include those dozen or so High Rollers that can Bankroll the entire promotion with some post fight partying and gambling. It's why Casinos can pretty much outbid any Arena for a Fight they want, and also why they're not overly enthusiastic about MMA, at least not like they are Boxing. |
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Post by billyc on Aug 31, 2010 8:49:17 GMT -5
There was a study done on it a couple of years ago and it is fact that despite the great turnouts, popularity and money made with MMA, the casinos do not support it because Boxing is "their" crowd....when you think about it, it ALWAYS has been. Back in the day, betting was on boxing....it has been a marriage ever since. You are right about the big-time gambler. I was shocked to hear that ONE big-Timer will lose enough money in one night to pay for Cesar Palace's Bar Tab! Think About THAT!!! Most are boxing fans...or at least turn out for boxing events.
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Post by bourbonblues on Aug 31, 2010 9:00:53 GMT -5
Personally, I think MMA isn't competition to boxing at all. I think it is doing a real number on pro wrestling, though.
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Post by mh2365 on Aug 31, 2010 13:07:48 GMT -5
yeah bourbon I always thought the same ... pro wrestling fan is the one who likes MMA .... but then again that could just be the boxing snob in me
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Post by davemurphy on Sept 2, 2010 8:42:04 GMT -5
Yeah, I don't know why so many in the Boxing Business became so concerned with MMA in the first place, I think it was just a case of being mad that some PPV Money was being made and they didn't have any hand in it......but it was NEVER a case where they were actually TAKING our Fans. Some Boxing Fans started following MMA (I still know many that do) or they ignored it (like I did), but I don't know ANYBODY who completely abandoned Boxing for it.
I do think we have a problem with attracting younger fans, but I beleive that is due to errors WE'VE made, and would exist with or without MMA ever having come along.
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Post by mh2365 on Sept 2, 2010 14:50:20 GMT -5
You will never see Castillo-Corrales in MMA ... there just is no ebb and flow in a match. One guy falls down and the other humps him into submission ... oops I mean punches him into submission.
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Post by davemurphy on Sept 3, 2010 6:14:43 GMT -5
You will never see Castillo-Corrales in MMA ... there just is no ebb and flow in a match. One guy falls down and the other humps him into submission ... oops I mean punches him into submission. Yeah, when I ask my MMA friends about that, they always say "well, there's a lot of fights where the ground game isn't dominate and they do a lot of standup combat", but I never see them. |
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