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Post by mh2365 on Aug 10, 2010 21:17:34 GMT -5
of course if Dawson struggles or loses this fight then clearly he is finished because in today's boxing you aren't allowed to struggle. If he struggles some people won't be able to "fathom" (spelled correctly) how he would even be able to compete with Zsolt Erdei ...
Styles make fights ... it was true back in the 20's and it is true today ... but some can't see that and if a fighter struggles with one style then clearly they suck.
It is sad that in today's world you not only can't lose but you can't even struggle to an ugly win without people giving up on you.
There would be no Glencoffee Johnson in today's world because after his first loss certain "boxing" fans would give up on him .... hell Manny wouldn't be Manny if he was a young fighter today because he not only lost but was KO'd in the third round twice early!!!
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Post by davemurphy on Aug 11, 2010 4:22:26 GMT -5
I'm picking Dawson in this one. He throws punches three minutes a round for 12 rounds while Pascal fights in spurts -- though those spurts are often spectacular. The key to the fight will be the first four rounds because that will determine whether the home crowd advantage will kick in. And what a crowd advantage it will be, because the Bell Centre houses the loudest boxing crowd in North America. The volume is utterly ear-splitting. Pascal's promoter told me that Jean feeds off the crowd like few fighters have and if he can grab their attention early and ride the wave he could do something special. Conversely, it's Dawson's job to keep them quiet. I believe Chad's work rate and superior experience at the world class level will pull him through -- if the judging is fair. Lee- As with any title fight in Montreal, I usually wonder about the Day of the Fight location of Marlon B. Wright as well as some of the questionable Judges in the Past Personally, I like the idea of Dawson having his Back against the Wall, facing a good fighter that should make him fight and a hostile enviroment of 16K to boot. Some guys NEED that to bring out their best, perhaps Chad Dawson is one of those.
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Post by mh2365 on Aug 11, 2010 6:34:41 GMT -5
No kidding Murph ...
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Post by billyc on Aug 11, 2010 13:52:16 GMT -5
I like Pascal's chances in this fight. I think Dawson, as talented as he is, is a product of his level of opposition....which has be old fighters. With the exception of ONE of the Johnson fights, he has not looked that good. He will box well, and will move well, but I think Jean will cut the ring off and make this like the Froch fight and will "shock the world"....or at least the bookies!
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Post by davemurphy on Aug 11, 2010 15:15:09 GMT -5
We disagree, but I think thats' why we like this fight, it IS a huge Challenge and it IS a Pick 'em fight given the circumstances, something that doesn't fit with HBO's M.O. the last few years. I understand your thinking vis-a-vis the Froch fight, but I think while he might cut the Ring off with some success, your kind of forgetting that Carl Froch has the worst defense on the entire planet Dawson should be able to pick off more of Pascal's shots than Froch, hell the Venus De Milo could pick off more than Froch
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Post by Daxx on Aug 11, 2010 19:25:51 GMT -5
We disagree, but I think thats' why we like this fight, it IS a huge Challenge and it IS a Pick 'em fight given the circumstances, something that doesn't fit with HBO's M.O. the last few years. I understand your thinking vis-a-vis the Froch fight, but I think while he might cut the Ring off with some success, your kind of forgetting that Carl Froch has the worst defense on the entire planet Dawson should be able to pick off more of Pascal's shots than Froch, hell the Venus De Milo could pick off more than Froch Ha Ha Ha ha you got me laughing my ass off with that Venus De Milo comment I am going to steal that one from you (With Credit) when I do my preview for Froch /AA..... You said one thing though that really made sense and that the part about "Thats why we like this fight"...Your right this is a fight that has all the elements to get a fight fan excited....2 young champion each with a question mark of his own type lingering.....These are the fights that we have not seen since the early 90's in the LHW division....I wish there were more guys in the division to keep it at this interesting level to KEEP us peaked...I mean right now Beibut is a champion....Does not help the scene
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Post by brad444 on Aug 13, 2010 23:23:33 GMT -5
I like Pascal....he looked strong at the weigh-in....Dawson looked a little drained. Dawson hasn't fought (recently) somebody with the speed and youth that Pascal has....this could be a great fight!!
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Post by davemurphy on Aug 14, 2010 12:13:32 GMT -5
We disagree, but I think thats' why we like this fight, it IS a huge Challenge and it IS a Pick 'em fight given the circumstances, something that doesn't fit with HBO's M.O. the last few years. I understand your thinking vis-a-vis the Froch fight, but I think while he might cut the Ring off with some success, your kind of forgetting that Carl Froch has the worst defense on the entire planet Dawson should be able to pick off more of Pascal's shots than Froch, hell the Venus De Milo could pick off more than Froch Ha Ha Ha ha you got me laughing my ass off with that Venus De Milo comment I am going to steal that one from you (With Credit) when I do my preview for Froch /AA..... You said one thing though that really made sense and that the part about "Thats why we like this fight"...Your right this is a fight that has all the elements to get a fight fan excited....2 young champion each with a question mark of his own type lingering.....These are the fights that we have not seen since the early 90's in the LHW division....I wish there were more guys in the division to keep it at this interesting level to KEEP us peaked...I mean right now Beibut is a champion....Does not help the scene LOL, feel free to use the Venus De Milo line, credited or not, I kind of got a chuckle out of that one as I typed it Yeah, these are the type of fights we love to see, and for HBO are kind of a change of pace.........a fight where it's not about the showcase HBO House Fighter looking good, but an actual Even fight. What I don't know is if HBO realizes Pascal is so dangerous or they're thinking Dawson will win more easily than the two of us think he will.......not to mention BC who's going with Pascal to win.
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Post by davemurphy on Aug 14, 2010 12:26:36 GMT -5
I like Pascal....he looked strong at the weigh-in....Dawson looked a little drained. Dawson hasn't fought (recently) somebody with the speed and youth that Pascal has....this could be a great fight!! Yeah, Pascal looked great at the weigh-in, didn't he? One thing I have heard is that as yesterday morning, they'd only sold 6000 tickets, which I found VERY surprising. I figured those would be gobbled up by now and a full house cheering Pascal on. But other than that, it seems like all signs point to Pascal. I think Dawson is going to win narrowly, but I also think there's a VERY good chance that I'm fooling myself by ignoring all the warning signs, everything Billy C. and others like yourself have been saying has been true, the Stars appear lined-up in Pascal's favor.
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Post by Daxx on Aug 14, 2010 17:29:11 GMT -5
Hey Dawson may shine bright but I just get a feeling...I will say whenh it comes to picking fights I am not in the 90% so...Just Pascal looks hungrier and looks as though he wants it more plus Chad looked lazy last time out...We will find out in a few hours
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Post by mh2365 on Aug 15, 2010 12:05:58 GMT -5
I will preface this by saying that with Pascal being the actual champ and it being in Montreal Dawson didn't do enough but I had Dawson up 6-5.
Manny was 100% correct though he would consistently hurt Pascal and then give him 20 seconds or so to recover. But on the other hand Pascal would jump in throw 9 punches, 2 of which would land, then do nothing else for a minute or so. Of course the crowd would go nuts and the two judges who have scored Pascal fights in Montreal before would get all warm and fuzzy.
Dawson may have stopped him in the last round and a half but my guess is he would have let Pascal off the hook.
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Post by billyc on Aug 15, 2010 12:15:05 GMT -5
Maybe my TV went mute for that, but I never heard Manny say he thought or even eluded to the fact Dawson won. I also can't see anyone but Ray Charles think Dawson was ahead 6-5 at the time of the stoppage and also....please let me borrow your crystal ball because if you think, based on one round (I also don't recall Dawson constantly hurting Pascal) that Dawson was on his way to KO Pascal, you must have watched a differant fight. To me, a fighter who was dominated does not "let his opponent off the hook". Pascal was never on the hook.
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Post by davemurphy on Aug 15, 2010 12:25:34 GMT -5
Sorry, Mike, I didn't hear that either. Manny was eluding constantly to Dawson having opportunities, but I never heard him say he actually had him ahead. I just kind of wrote it up to Manny angling to get ahold of Chad Dawson from Eddie Mustafa after the Loss, as in HIS appearing to be the answer to Chad's problems. Manny is pretty sly sometimes I watched the fight again this morning, and focusing on those points where Pascal was "hurt", I do think that the HBO cheerleaders were overestimating the degree to which he was "ready to go". All except for Merchant, who had nothing good to say about either fighter the entire night.
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Post by mh2365 on Aug 15, 2010 13:57:34 GMT -5
oops it just reads wrong ... Manny thought he was losing ... I meant Manny was 100% correct that Dawson would hurt Pascal and then do nothing for 20 seconds or so
also I did say MAY have but even if Dawson had him hurt like he did in the 11th he probably would have let him off the hook.
IMO anytime Dawson threw more than the jab he dominated the fight, problem is he didn't do it enough. I also don't think Pascal landed very much. Like I said he would jump in throw 9 punches and land maybe two and the crowd would go crazy ... then he wouldn't do much for another 30 seconds or so.
I said Pascal would win the fight and I have no problem with the outcome just thought one judge ruling it 108-101 was absurd as it was much much closer than that.
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Post by davemurphy on Aug 16, 2010 9:42:51 GMT -5
Guys- I think if Chad Dawson made one mistake it was this, he was scoring the Rounds in his own head, not just fighting them. I truely believe that when he'd back off as Pascal once again showed him some resistance and was going to survive, he would mentally Bank the Round in his favor. He fell in love with his own 30 second spurts, didn't seem to realize that Pascal shots that didn't actually hurt him still score points, and most of all (ABOVE ALL ELSE) when you worry about the "Zero" and measure off what you think is just enough to win, you can fool yourself.
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